M.A.E. Chats: Navigating the Job Market in Your 20s
Are you tired of feeling overwhelmed and frustrated with the job market? Madison, Ava and Elle talk about their current job market struggles in their 20s, from the stress of unemployment to being employed, and trying not to crash out in the process. From dealing with rejection and self-doubt to finding ways to stay motivated and focused, we're sharing our unfiltered thoughts. If you're struggling to find a job or feeling stuck in your career, this chat is for you!
In this episode:
0:00 – Intro: Choosing Your Hard in the Job Search
A raw welcome into the conversation around funemployment, rejection, resilience, and redefining success in your twenties.
4:33 – When the Dream Job Falls Apart
The chaos of losing a job you thought you had. Learning to pivot when plans crumble overnight.
8:16 – Applying at Midnight: The Wild West of LinkedIn
The randomness of job applications — from 9AM hustle to 12AM desperation scrolls.
12:41 – Using AI in Your Job Search (the Right Way)
How ChatGPT helps…and how it can hurt. Why adding your own flair still matters.
16:50 – Breakthrough Moments & Ice Cappuccinos
Getting the job offer while in the salon chair. Celebratory Tim Hortons runs. The moment things turned.
20:10 – Eight Months of Silence: Rejections & Resilience
Three interviews. Eight months. Dozens of applications. What kept them going through the radio silence.
24:00 – Rejection is Protection (and Sometimes Redirection)
Why “no” can be a good thing. How the job that didn’t work out made space for the one that did.
27:45 – Be Determined, Not Desperate
How to hold self-worth steady when the interviews don’t come. The difference between persistence and panic.
31:30 – Living a Thousand Lives in Your Twenties
Why it’s okay to chase multiple dreams—sports, fashion, nonprofits—and why your twenties are made for it.
36:05 – Growing Into Your Opportunities
From ice cream scooper to entrepreneur. Why success in your 30s can be even sweeter.
40:12 – The Patience Lesson: Why It’s Taking Time
Why it’s not happening yet. The role of time in mastering your craft, your confidence, and your calling.
44:53 – What We Failed At This Week
An honest wrap-up: small failures, unexpected wins, and finding humor in the mess.
Chapter Three with Britt Baker (The Artist's Way): https://youtu.be/vyVZJWe9iPs?si=SI6oUWnVnn2TOeJZ
Chapter Six: Postgrad Playbook with Jahleane Dolne: https://youtu.be/t0YqzYN90Z4?si=m4D8lUH5gxz7hLCg
Volume One of The 20 Something Playbook is out now (new episodes every Tuesday): https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1Rs9oUYUlEcNigeakfAcHDyKl2mSlAJ6&si=3gNbVkQVqg6abe60
Listen to episodes:
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1bAA0eOHthyeqJyIyWlcD3?si=cPnjpInHTDSGuMWc3p7ufQ
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/the-20-something-playbook/id1801522743
Follow us on TikTok and Instagram @20SomethingPlaybook
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@20somethingplaybook
Thank you for tuning in!!
Transcript
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Okay. Alright. We're going to check because we're having audio problems. Nobody say anything yet. Yeah. Okay. Okay. You can hear us. Yay. Okay. You can hear. Okay. Okay, so this has been quite the process. We had a wasp in the living room
Speaker 2 (00:22):
And our dog's allergic to a wasp, so Ava had to vacuum that. Right. I
Speaker 1 (00:26):
Had to vacuum it and then I put the vacuum outside. Then it flies out of the vacuum. It's not so don't judge us, but that's all. What am I going to do? I don't have, have a cup or we don't have magazines in the house. I don't know. Yes. I don't know what people normally do, but it's going to go outside. Okay. It always flies out of the vacuum Anyway, so yes, the vacuum is currently on the front porch. Don't steal it. Thank you. Thank you very much. So sorry we're late to our failure.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Yeah, we just went live and our microphones weren't working but luckily Elle figured it out.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
So we are 12 minutes late for our millions of fans.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
So many. It looks like
Speaker 1 (01:03):
There's so many of them. It's a ghost town in here. It is.
Speaker 2 (01:08):
It's actually better
Speaker 1 (01:08):
That way. Know we're okay with that? Just the three you
Speaker 2 (01:13):
I'm I'm Madison. Oh, I'm Ava. And this is a segment of the 20 something playbook we're calling. This is Maddie's idea. MAE. So that is our work name together. Mads and Ava, Elle. And today we're talking about navigating the job market in the twenties.
Speaker 1 (01:33):
Yes,
Speaker 2 (01:33):
And there's this statistic that I read that said between February to April, 2025, there were 625,000 young people. The young people, I sound like a senior citizen. There's 625,000 young people, age 16 to 24. You are an old person, who were unemployed, which is 42,000 more than the previous year. And the unemployment rate for young, the unemployment rate for young people keep calling it young people, let's just call it young adults. The unemployment rate for young adults was 14.3%, which is up from 13.6% from the year before. So safe to say,
Speaker 1 (02:19):
Oh my god, Maddie, that was a lot of stats.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
I know there was a lot of stats, but basically there's a lot of recent graduates.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
I think my mic was muted
Speaker 2 (02:28):
And 20 somethings who are dealing with unemployment. We call it fun employment. I actually saw something on LinkedIn about a fun employment get together in la, which is really fun. Get together. What? I didn't know that this come from. Yeah, basically we're, I'm just
Speaker 1 (02:46):
Deleting our failure by
Speaker 2 (02:48):
The way. Yeah. There's some serious job market struggles out there for the young people. Yes, for the young people. So yeah, I think we're going to kind of today talk about our experiences. Elle just got a job last month,
Speaker 1 (03:06):
So
Speaker 2 (03:06):
She's employed,
Speaker 1 (03:07):
She's very employed. Very. It's a Sunday and in case you're wondering why I keep looking over this way, the F1 race is on. I'm get comfortable. So I was getting kind of crazy.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
Sorry. But yeah, so Elle's employed and Ava and I aren't employed so we wanted to kind of talk about the contrast of experiences between the three of us. I think we're representing the unemployed and employed population and even our podcast guests have talked about, I know Thamina who is yet to her episode is yet to air, but she was talking about she knew a recent graduate from Berkeley, which I'm pretty sure is an Ivy League school.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
Don't say that.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
I know, but it's a big school graduating with a great degree and she's struggling to get a job and so I think that's just where we're at our generation right now. So I think let's just get into each of our stories and kind of talking about our unique struggles and how we're coping with stress, whether we have a job or not, because we were laughing about this the other
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Day. Yeah. Does someone want to ask you how many times I've cried this week?
Speaker 2 (04:05):
I was going to ask you that later. I have a terrible answer, but here if you want to answer it now, go ahead to the juicy stuff.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Someone ask
Speaker 2 (04:12):
Me, how many times have you cried this week?
Speaker 1 (04:15):
The fact that I even have to think and count is really sad.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
This is not a few times for Ava. I'm not like a huge crier. I'll cry during a movie but I don't really cry. I cry so much during movies. I cry during books and movies but for real life and I realize it's my lack of, I have no balance right now. Being fun employed is definitely fun. I'm tanning every day. She's
Speaker 2 (04:38):
Getting a killer tan.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
Honestly, don't say that for us for for pale, but believe it or not, we were paler. Believe it it or not, this is a tan for me. Ava has been outside every day and I've been inside. She's been out there roasting those spindles. Sibling tan competition. I'm currently in the lead. Usually I'm in the lead, so this one really hurts. Yeah. So I've been spending a lot of time doing that, but that does not replace a social life or a job or an income. So it's fun but it's not everything. Yeah. Cried a few times this week, but it's really, I think just because I have no social life.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Well, let's get into also I think how her brain works. We talk about Dr. Helen Fisher talked about this. Oh,
Speaker 1 (05:25):
I was going to think the
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Facts. You can read more about her work. I'm not going to get into it on this particular episode, but she basically discovered that everyone has different, there's four different kinds of brain chemicals. Everyone's dominant in a different kind of brain chemical and the one that Ava and Elle are dominant in is serotonin. So their brain is serotonin dominant. You can do a test on her website to determine what you are. It's like Maddie does on her free time test. Yes, you guys did. I tested them
Speaker 1 (05:52):
To know what they were. This is what Maddie does on her free
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Time. And so serotonin dominance, basically this tying back to how many times Ava cried this week because she's serotonin dominant and serotonin dominant people need a sense of community. They're super social and that is what's lacking in her life right now. And we talked about that and Ava was like, oh my gosh, you're right.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Well we joked with one of our friends who's similar to, she's got a job now too, but when she was in the job marketing looking in the job market, she literally was joking that she was like, yes, she was broke, she wanted money, but she also just wanted to get out of the house and talk to people her age. Is it a bug? It's a fluff That just
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Magic. It was a wasp,
Speaker 1 (06:32):
But her other motivation was that she just wanted to get out and talk to people her age and I'm like, that's me. That's so valid. From September to June, I was searching for a job like September 2024 to June. I was just going to say quickly though that I also think for me it's a subconscious thing because I'm really happy and then suddenly I'll just be really, not necessarily sad, but I just feel like crying and I think it's just my lack of balance for my brain. Chemicals.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
After talking to Maddie,
Speaker 2 (07:04):
I realize this. Yeah, and they're also, they're more extroverted. Ava and Elle are introverted extroverts and I'm an extroverted introvert. I
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Love being at home, but I think I need social interaction more than I think I do. I love being at home, but I think the crying has apparently been coming from, I don't know, it's very odd. Well I said I had the same was having her, we won't call it breakdown. Yeah, maybe she's crashing out. Apparently everyone's crashing out right now. I keep seeing that online. I will not be here. You're on trend. Not crashing with a black screen, but her crash out sounded exactly like a crash out that I had back in the winter. She did winter. Why did I say that? I was back in the winter back at winters back in the winter, but I had the same summer sale issue and then it kind of got healed when I got a job. So I was like, girl, I'm sorry. I know you can't control that. It's situational. It's situational. Girls applying every day. You did cry a lot. It was like nighttime and Elle and I share a room, so we always get into talking to each other at one in the morning and then Elle will just be crying. We'll be holding hands,
(08:09)
Holding. We don't hold hands If you're really sad, I hold your hand whether you like it or not. Yeah. I'm a little bit more touchy so I'm like,
Speaker 2 (08:16):
It's okay. So touchy. You have a job interview
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Monday. I have a job interview tomorrow at 2:00 PM Wish me luck or zero people are going to wish you.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
I've had two job interviews so far and they both have been so sketchy, so
Speaker 1 (08:31):
It's okay. I'm also going to say this, do the proper research into your job interviews. Madison. I'm talking, I'm serious. I'm going to be honest, but Maddie looks at me and she's like, you sent me that and I was like, I don't screen all of your interviews, not your interviews. I don't screen all of your job applications. One them I see a headline, like a title and I'm like, Maddie could do that and I send it to you. It's your job to
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Research also. But also let's talk about this because you heard back from a possible interview. No. And remember how they were basically trying to get you to do work for nothing?
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Yeah. I recently, everyone watch out for that, watch out for that. I was going to a Blue Jays game with Elle and our best friend Jenna and I was just having an absolute ball. I hadn't heard from any of my jobs and I was getting three rejections a day, so that's not really fun. But they weren't necessarily jobs I wanted anyway, so it was like, okay, I've been applying to so many that it's like I'm going to get a ton of rejections. But anyway, I go out with my best friend, we're off to a baseball game and finally I get a response from someone but I didn't really read it properly and I was just excited. I read it later that day and the things they wanted me to do for an interview was insane. What was it like 40? It was because Ava and I are in social media content creation. Yeah, that's what we're, but that's current job. That's my current job, but Ava is also looking at that because we have very similar portfolios and so they were make an eight week content plan, edit 50 photos, for eight weeks in 48 hours in 48 hours and that's your job interview. I'm also going to say they're just trying to use you. I'm also going to say that they didn't, I have not spoken to these people on the phone on
(10:16)
Video.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
This is before the interview.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Every job interview I've had, it starts usually with a phone screening, which just means a phone call. You get on a phone call with the hiring manager, the hiring, the hiring committee, the recruiter or whatever you want to call it, but you get on the phone with them. Sorry, I was not even funny. I was thinking about something funny. Okay. I was like, why are you laughing at that? I care to share with the class Madison. You get on the phone screening, you have the phone screening. It's basically just a phone call, get to know each other, ask what your experience, la dah. If they like you, then usually you get another interview and then that's on Zoom or it's a project of sorts, whatever. Anyway, Ava just gets this email that tells her to do
(10:58)
Seven project things. I'm going to read this in 48 hours. You don't mind my read it. It's three degrees out today. All of our hair if curly Celsius or Canadian, I'm turning into a lion. Yes, Celsius. Correct. Okay. This project will include four parts, 25 photos to be edited by yourself using Lightroom editing, 20 to 45 second recap video clips. Also, weren't they going to send you the photos, which is also going to their videos they're going to use and their photos. An email created promoting an event we have coming up include text graphics, our logo and anything else you see fit and this is the one that got me an eight week content plan.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
That one got me too.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Eight week content
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Plan and they gave you 48 hours to get that done, which is insane.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Yeah, they say get this done in 48 hours and then they're like, and to be transparent, this is part one of part two of the hiring process and this happens, dad, do you guys let us know if you think this is normal?
Speaker 2 (11:56):
I don't think it's, it's not normal. Even we talked to our dad about it and this happened with him. I'm not going to say what company it was, but it was a well-known company and they did the same thing with my dad's work and
Speaker 1 (12:07):
They ended up declining work. They didn't want to work with him and then a month later they were using all of the things that my dad and his company did. It was like a mock, so this has this
Speaker 2 (12:18):
At any level
Speaker 1 (12:19):
With no pay, they didn't pay him. Yeah, just be careful with
Speaker 2 (12:23):
That because they're capitalizing on our
Speaker 1 (12:24):
Desperation Again, if anybody has gone a job like this and it's like they had to do that, but I also just find it weird that it's before them even meeting me on the phone.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Yeah. Well even I had an interview, I think it was a couple of weeks ago and it was for a video hosting for a social media page and I got on the phone and first of all the interview just felt really strange and unprofessional and it was hard to locate their office. It was very, you
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Also get a
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Clear
Speaker 1 (12:53):
Vibe. I was going to say, one of my friends said this too is like they're interviewing you but you're also kind of interviewing them. Do you really want to work with these people? That's what I mean. Be
Speaker 2 (13:04):
Pleasant and friendly. Of course. Don't be rude.
Speaker 1 (13:07):
Yeah, don't be rude about it. Just take note of their vibe
Speaker 2 (13:10):
And if you have questions, I asked this person questions. I had some serious questions. One of the things was, and easy to answer questions. One of the red flags to me was during the interview I asked because they asked, do you have any questions for me? I was like, I have a ton of questions for you. One of them being you said your pay range is this amount to this amount. How do you determine that and what would I be getting paid and they could not give me a clear answer and that right there I was like, that sounds like you're trying, again, almost similar to Ava. You're trying to get me to do work for nothing and it's also too about trusting your gut feeling. I just had this gut feeling that even if I did take the job and I did the work, that it would be really complicated to work with this person that there's a possibility that this person or this company wouldn't be able to pay me and maybe screw me out of things. So I think and I trusted my gut and I feel good about that decision even though I need to make money and I need to get a job.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
Even in mine it was supposedly a part-time job and so I responded and I just said, this seems like a heavy amount of work for just an interview. And I just said I would love to hop on the phone first and chat more about the role before I do this project and they never got back to me. So
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Yeah, it's
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Also a red flag I think that tells you right there. Yeah. I think if you're not even willing, I don't know.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
It's weird. Let's talk about how we deal with stress because Ellie, you have a job and stress that comes with that job. This is a full-time job, so how are you dealing? We're going to talk. Talk about how each of us deals with stress, whether you're employed or you're not employed.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
Well, I just find when you have a full-time job, you have to get better with scheduling everything because you have such limited time to yourself and also just the amount of projects. The kind of job that I have is I kind of make my own schedule in a way. It's remote. It's remote but it's also because I'm creating videos and I'm filming videos. I create short form content for social media and I go out and film people as well. So it like hockey games and stuff? Yeah, I go to hockey games. You poor thing. Yeah, I know I love it. But the thing is with that I create my own schedule because they've never really had anyone in this role before and I decide when I go to games, they gave me a rough schedule of what my days look like, but I don't know, you just have to get really good with scheduling because also with our podcast I want to help them out and I'm like, I have to find 30 minute increments where I'm like, okay, I can edit a video for you guys in this 30 minute increment and then I have a million other things to do and then I also have to, my personality is also I have to relax at some point I have to read or something to shut my brain off.
(16:01)
So I also try to schedule in my down moments, which is usually just watching prison break these days. Right. Show. It's a great show, but I don't know, do you guys want to prompt me on stuff? I was just going to say that. What do you want me to say? I was just going to say this is random, but I was going to say that usually I also read to relax. I'm reading the summer book and I should have known it was coming, but her dad's dying of cancer and I haven't opened it. This is the longest that I haven't read in a long time. I think it's been 24 hours, but is it because it's too sad? Well yeah, everything started to hit. Shit started. It was really good. It was really good and then now everything's starting to get really bad and I'm like, I'm already kind of stressed out. The podcast is really fun and it's been a ton of work. I've been taking on some of what Elle's editing, Ava's editing the whole thing. Yeah, they've taken on a lot of my work. I work full time, which I don't mind mind. I'm hoping I get a job soon when that comes. We'll see. We're going to make, well I think if you had a functional computer too.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
That's also a thing. Elle just got a new computer yesterday. She just upgraded. We're excited about that because I got my first
Speaker 1 (17:09):
Paycheck, it's like a full out recently here, so I was like, I'm getting a new one. I do. I didn't skimp Well, I did skimp, but I'm like, I got a ton of storage. You didn't skimp but you need it. I didn't but I got the cheaper version of not skimping. I do think maybe some upgraded technology would help, but it doesn't really matter. Tech issues are always going to be there.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
How I've been dealing with stress, if that's okay to segway, I started reading the Artist's Way and Britt Baker who we can link the episode but it's in our 20 something playbook volume one playlist with Britt Baker of Dow Janes. She shared that this book was super pivotal in her twenties and so she actually gifted all of us each a copy with a personal note, which was so kind and lovely and she could tell Ava and Elle apart, which was so impressive.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Yeah, that
Speaker 2 (18:01):
One
Speaker 1 (18:02):
Surprised me. That surprised me too because she said specific things that would definitely only apply to me. Well, she said to Ava,
Speaker 2 (18:07):
Don't lose your spunk or something like that, right? Yeah, she knew. Yeah, she knew and so I started reading it. I'm on week six and there's 12 weeks and it's been honestly my coping mechanism for unemployment. She's been taking herself on dates. You do like these artist dates. She has a nasty burn on her back, but I've been going on bike rides. You do these two hour artist dates once a week with yourself. It doesn't need to be anything fancy. I don't go to dinner with myself. I just go on bike rides and swim and do whatever I want. It's too
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Expensive for an unemployed
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Girl so quick, but I've been having so much fun and it's been too much for unemployed, girly. Yeah, seriously. Honestly. It's just been such a lovely coping mechanism and I've also started doing these, Marissa Pier has these hypnosis that what you've been doing, audios and I've been doing that for the past week and a bit. They're long. Yeah, they're like 30 minutes.
Speaker 1 (19:03):
Yeah. She'll be like, I'm going to go do a meditation, meditation and then she'll be gone for a long time.
Speaker 2 (19:09):
It's intense
Speaker 1 (19:09):
And if everyone's being too loud she'll
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Go, oh my god. Yeah. I was doing it in the car yesterday and the radio went on and I was like, I can't do this. She almost had an aneurysm. Yeah, no, that was crazy. But it's been really helping me with because I think for me I'm 26, I have all these things of feeling bad about myself, about not having a job or money or whatever and so I think that's been really helping me feel a sense of self-worth when navigating the job market and just feeling like
Speaker 1 (19:39):
Now you have the burn to keep you preoccupied.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
Yeah. I have so many things keeping me busy, so many things and also in addition to all the job search, we're running a podcast and we're also screenwriters trying to get a show made, so there's a lot. We are never not.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
It's a lot of tabs open
Speaker 2 (19:54):
And the screenwriting and the podcast. Right. We need a better
Speaker 1 (19:58):
Wrong.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
Yeah, sorry. It doesn't pay the bills so currently that's the thing too is building. We're building to get there, but in the meantime we have to make money.
Speaker 1 (20:09):
Yeah. I felt bad because I was laughing the other day. I was like, I don't know why I'm crying over the stress load. Like I enjoy doing the podcast. It's a lot of editing and stuff. I told you why you're crying. No, no, you told me already haven't got you need social. I was just saying, I was like, I'm sure other people can relate to this because one of our good friends, we literally talked about this, she's very extroverted. She literally, her main goal for getting a job was just so that she could get out of the house and talk to people and that was literally one of my goals too. Whereas for me, I'm remote but actually I'm hybrid. That's why she's hybrid because I do go out to people. Also my coworkers, we go downtown,
Speaker 2 (20:43):
But I think the reason the artist's way has been working well for me is just to tie it back into the employment stuff is that for me what matters is I like adventures and having adventures and I don't really need to be socializing to
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Be happy. Can I say something about having a job after? Quick Go for it right
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Now.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Oh, right now she said go. I was just going to say though that I feel like I'm okay with being a little bit stressed. I like being busy so having a full-time job really fits the bill for me. I like being busy. I like getting out. I like talking to people. I like working with the team. I love all of that so that I really enjoy, there's a level of stress that's going to come with being employed and being unemployed and I'd rather be stressed, and employed than be stressed and unemployed.
(21:29)
Money coming because when you're stress and you're employed, it's more just kind of like you're working, you're doing things and there's deadlines and there's things you have to get done, but it's not like, I don't know, it's not that. There's uncertainty about future in the bank account. There's uncertainty. You know what you're working towards. There's things that are certain and that are clear. What I will say is that how I deal with, because you also need to wind down after the day. Reading helps a lot and for me, I'm reading a really flaky book right now. Well, I thought mine was so the flaky the better I needed. Well when you have a
Speaker 2 (22:09):
Lot and this is me, you should read the Bridgerton book I'm reading right now. I'm not into bridgerton. It's really I'm not huge on the bridgerton. I know, but this one I think you'd like The character reminds me of you. I know,
Speaker 1 (22:19):
But kind It has ton. No, I was going to say so but I was just going to go ahead. Sorry to wrap up this point that I feel like I'm trying to make for a while. I feel like it's good to have something outside of work that can calm you down and whatever that is For me it's reading. I also have a really cute Kindle case, which helps. It's so adorable. I brought it looks like a beach towel. That's crazy. She got it on. For me though, it's like reading or honestly watching a show with the family at night, just something to take your mind off of what you've been thinking about all day. It can get I feel like quite a bit if that's, and also I keep seeing these tiktoks of people being point of view. You're at a, I mean this is corporate job to be fair.
(23:04)
I don't really have a corporate job, but they're like me at 10:45 after I have all my work done and they're just playing on their computer and they're bored. Well, I'm like, I use up every single hour of my workday. Who are these people that have no work to do? I feel like I finished my day and I'm like, I didn't even get everything done that I wanted to. I get my deadlines done, but I like to get ahead. My goals for the day are usually to edit a bunch of videos and have a few ahead, but sometimes I just get it done just in time. I am like, I'm working.
Speaker 2 (23:37):
How are these people working? Have you had any breakthrough? What are your takeaways of this breakthrough? Got a so was there a breakthrough moment? Was there a lesson learned? Can you share a bit about what
Speaker 1 (23:51):
Do you mean a breakthrough moment when I got the job or when I Do you guys want to hear about? Do you have something to say to that? Well, can you elaborate? What are you asking me? I certainly extremely random. I can contribute whatever you guys want in your job search. Pivotal moment in my job search. Yeah, maybe getting breakthrough. Breakthrough. Well, honestly, the job search is kind of random. I just sent out, can't really control who I remember I'd apply to things at sometimes 12 in the morning if I was in bed on LinkedIn. I don't know, I was kind of, or at 9:00 AM if I saw a job, I'd click an easy apply. One thing I will say is you can use AI as an assistant, but it can't replace, don't just use AI to add your own flare.
Speaker 2 (24:38):
Well, Chat GPT helps.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
I've heard multiple people say who work in recruiting and hiring. They're like, Chat GPT is making everyone look kind of stupid, be like, I know they'll give people a project to do for an interview and then everyone just thrown it into Chat GPT and they'll all have the same thing. So it's like just AI is a great tool, but keep it's an assistant. Keep in mind that it's an assistant and it shouldn't replace what you do
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Because
Speaker 1 (25:04):
They can see through it
Speaker 2 (25:07):
With it. You're not using it to create from, you're using it to co-create.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Exactly. Even when I do cover letters, I always try to add my own personality to it because I think it's important personally. For sure. Yeah. Yeah, and often times what I've heard too is in the job market is people are just looking for someone that they would enjoy working with. I do think that kind of boils down to it as well, but yeah, I don't know if I've had a breakthrough moment
Speaker 2 (25:32):
Or lesson learned.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
I'm happy. I have a job. Very happy, very
Speaker 2 (25:36):
Thrilled. Did you have caffeine, had celebratory for this interview that went well. I remember last time you were like, I need caffeine.
Speaker 1 (25:43):
I think I did. Yeah, I think I did, but I had a celebratory Tim horton's ice cap when I got this job. She sure did and I had, that was really fun. A cappuccino just because, just for fun. Just for fun, just to be fun. I got the email that I got this job while I was getting my haircut and then I was laughing because the week after I got my haircut and I was like, oh my god, this is it going to happen to you? I'm going to get a job interview. And I got three rejections in the chair, so rejected. I'm not even exaggerating. It was funny was email. Email rejected for six. Wait, September, October, October, November, December, January, February, March, April, may. I was looking for a job for eight months, man. And I was desperate for one because, and I'll tell you why, because oh guys, it's okay. I'm just kidding.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
For a long time even I keep joking. In high school musical, these kids was like, we're all in this together. We're in fun employment together. People tell me right now, I was
Speaker 1 (26:43):
But I was going to say sorry. Sorry. I was going to say that the reason I wanted a job, I really wanted a job badly because I had sounds so stupid. I had a job before and then I lost
Speaker 2 (26:54):
The job. Oh, that was crazy. You're going to work. And then everything fell apart. They said
Speaker 1 (26:57):
I was going to work full time and then the thing summer it fell apart. I'm not going to explain what it was, but that's a whole other, the people I were working for, it fell apart. What I working was working for, I'm not going to say what it was, but whatever I was working for fell apart and so they were like, oh, we're going to get you to work full time. And I was like, oh my God, yay. Life's great. This even. And then literally a week later it fell apart and then I was like was, oh God, you were making bank too. Well bank for me, it's not that much, but it's enough for someone to start who lives at home. I mean, I'm extremely grateful and very lucky that we still live at home. Honestly, any money is good money right now. Yeah, seriously. I spent a shot ton of money on the podcast, but what I was going to say is that, sorry. Yeah, go ahead. To finish my thought if anyone even cares is that I was desperate for a job because I lost one and I got used to working all the time and making money and I didn't like losing that. And then I remember right after I got two job interviews quite quickly after that, so I was very hopeful that I was going to get a job right away and then it was just radio silence for four months
Speaker 2 (28:01):
Maybe. Yeah, that
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Rough. That drove me nuts, rough. And I was applying a lot religiously on LinkedIn all the time, so that was really disheartening. But then I got another interview in January, that one didn't go well. That was the one I talked about on the podcast that didn't go well at all. And then the next one was the one that I got the job also did a shitty one and then I got a job after that. So just keep persevering. I guess that's keep persevering. I think the lesson is don't give up and even if you feel like it's not going to happen, it will.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
Well, she had a ton of interviews that didn't go.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
I was also going to say
Speaker 2 (28:38):
That three,
Speaker 1 (28:39):
Three, oh wait,
Speaker 2 (28:42):
Three
Speaker 1 (28:42):
In eight months. Yeah, I only had three in eight months. I got the fourth. I was also going to say though that the fourth one and the one that you have now fit perfectly is definitely the best fit. It's fun.
Speaker 2 (28:53):
Yeah. Oh my gosh. It's like a dream job for you. Dream job
Speaker 1 (28:56):
Didn't get the other one. You know what I mean? This one's fun and work environment. I remember applying, I remember applying to it even that long ago. I literally applied to that job and I thought to myself, that's my favorite one I've applied to so far. I feel very, guys, I'm telling you, I'm grateful she manifested this manifest. I feel very runners in my head that I still haven't heard back from and I'm just interested to see which one I get and I trying to positive vibes. I also think anyone who's applying just put out that there was one. Just put out the thoughts of like, I'm going to get the thing that's right for me. There was one that I applied to, so I'm a huge hockey fan and huge sports in general. I've always wanted to work in sports, but because I've spent the last four years working on screenwriting, I just thought that it wasn't in the cards for me, but now I am working in sports and I'm so happy and there was another job that I applied to right when I lost my other job in September and I got an interview at another hockey company and I wanted it so bad.
(29:57)
I was like, oh my God, it's in sports and it's in hockey and I love hockey and I didn't get it and I was so upset. But then eight months later I got this job and it's in hockey and it's better than the other one. It's so much better.
Speaker 2 (30:10):
I do
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Think, I just think everything works out the way it's supposed to. All that to say there's going to be a lot of ups and downs and roller coaster moments, but just you're not alone. You're not alone. I'm a big believer in whatever you believe in, spiritually, religiously. I think that they meet you halfway, I think put in the work and then everything else will figure itself out, but you have to put in the work too. We've all been applying a ton and we've been putting effort into each application. We actually just posted Jahleane's.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
Yeah, she has some really good advice.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
And
Speaker 2 (30:44):
The
Speaker 1 (30:44):
Postgrad playbook, she has,
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Sorry, she had a pdf.
Speaker 1 (30:48):
Know what you're going to say? No, you go ahead, but I was going to say something else. No, go for it. I was just going to say that Jahleane said something on her podcast that really stuck with me and she just said, whatever you do, just don't half ass it. And I totally agree. Just put your all into it. I also think it's so competitive these days that you have to put your all into it, but I do believe that putting your all into something, you're going to receive that back.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
And also rejection is protection. Ava, Elle and I all grew up in the entertainment industry, whether that was auditioning for dance or acting. So we actually have a very healthy relationship with rejection. If I get rejected from something, it does not.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
I agree. Bother me at all. Because
Speaker 2 (31:30):
As an actor, you never really get what you audition for and it's just the norm. It doesn't mean you're not good. It doesn't mean,
Speaker 1 (31:37):
And as a dancer too, you lose. You get,
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Yeah. But there's a thing that third players, you get first director wants. And I think it applies to any job, not just acting, but basically you have to be good and you have to be right for the part, right? For the role, right, for the job. And sometimes you're good and you're just not right. And just keep that in mind. Don't let a rejection mean you're not enough or that something's wrong.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
I had a few people who I did a phone screening or an interview and they'd message me back and be like, definitely apply again. If you see another, that's also good too. Opening within the company.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
I've been hearing that a lot from jobs. You're just not right for that specific role. That's been giving me reassurance. Actually. I got a couple of rejections from a couple of different companies, but they emailed me back and said, please look at other roles. So I think that was good feedback that they basically said you weren't the most qualified person for the position, but we like your resume and we please look at other
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Opportunities, so don't feel disheartened. You're going to be right for a, or sorry, a job that suits you better than I think you even know right now. That's what I believe.
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Yeah, and I think if you're unemployed
Speaker 1 (32:49):
Right now.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
Yeah, A funny story that I, this is, we're
Speaker 1 (32:51):
Speaking
Speaker 2 (32:52):
To the
Speaker 1 (32:52):
Unemployed. These are who are 20 even are turning 23 on Friday and I'm 26. I'm 26. And we're just in a phase where we want to be employed and I
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Mean, oh, another thing that I think helps, another thing that I think helps when you're going for anything, and we talk about this is be determined, not desperate. And sometimes you're going to be desperate. But I think reminding yourself of, because I think there can be such extreme highs and lows that I think just for me, what helps me is being like I'm determined to find my way. I'm determined to
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Figure out and to find a job that's suitable. Even I want to find something in an industry that I'm interested in. For me, it's like sports or fashion really are the things that I'm interested in. For me, I either want to sports or in fashion.
Speaker 2 (33:39):
Yeah, I want to do fashion nonprofits. I'm going to apply to a jewelry one today that I love. I consider fashion, fashion, beauty, I mean,
Speaker 1 (33:48):
You know what I mean? Jewelry.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
Another funny story, lifestyle. Another funny story I have is last week I heard back from a, it was like closet sales. Closets,
Speaker 1 (33:59):
Closets,
Speaker 2 (33:59):
Closets. And so I literally like, oh my gosh, I'm going to be Jay Pritchett working at Closets, closets, closets. That one didn't pan out because it was commission based, which is not what I'm looking for, but that was a really fun moment. My hair
Speaker 1 (34:11):
Is expanding by the second. Second. I was just going to say one last thing and it's actually super unimportant and then we'll let, oh my God, there's two people watching. Is it us? Hi. Hi. Maybe have you not seen people jumping on and
Speaker 2 (34:22):
Off? Yes, I have. I have. They keep coming and going. Thank you guys for being on. Thank you for coming on. This is so, oh, okay. And they're
Speaker 1 (34:30):
Gone. Oh my God. We scared them away. We scared
(34:32)
Them. They left guys. We didn't play it cool. Oh my God. Okay. But anyway, the reason I keep going on my phone, what was I going to say? Oh man. Okay. I'll just say something that's really, but the reason I keep looking at my phone is while I was getting ready for this, which was like maybe three minutes before we started, so if my face looks extremely dewy, it's still wet from when I washed it. She's just glowing. I'm not glowing. Yeah, it's terrible. But I was going to say that the reason I keep looking at my phone is while I was getting ready, I had little notes that I was taking of things I wanted to say and all of them were so unimportant. And I'll say the last one that I was going to say, which is literally please say them. You always think they're not important, but no, they're not. I promise you this one's not. I was going to say that the other day when I was having a tough moment, it was when I woke up from a nap, which usually I'm just on top of the world when I wake up from a nap, I'm usually wake up a brand new woman, a groggy new woman, but brand new, nonetheless groggy,
Speaker 2 (35:28):
New woman, rejuvenated.
Speaker 1 (35:29):
I got up and I was not feeling good, so I wasn't going to work out that day. And I was like, you know what, I should. So I got up and I working out and I still wasn't feeling better. And so I threw on a podcast. It wasn't our podcast. I've been editing those. I don't need to listen. She's heard those a bunch again. Thank you. But I threw on Brooke and Connor's podcast and that actually kept the tears at bay. Yeah, they're very only for an hour though. Only. I only listened to 'em for half an hour and then after that, yeah, I talked to my friends here, your best taste and then everything was fine. I think they kept the tears at bay. Literally. I wrote that down today. What's been
Speaker 2 (36:09):
Your biggest breakthrough in the job search or lesson you've taken away from this experience
Speaker 1 (36:13):
Lesson I've taken away. I actually do think one of my biggest lessons is one I've kind of already said is just don't half ass it put effort into your job applications. I think if you don't, no offense, but you're not going to hear anything. Some tough love. It's competitive. It's competitive right now. And I just find the ones that I do hear back from, I've put a little extra oomph into it. Put your own little, some of 'em have been easy applies too, where it's just like your resume in there. But I think if you have the opportunity to put a cover letter in, they're not going to think about it from the job recruiter's perspective. If somebody was applying and they put in a cover letter and then someone didn't, you're going to pick the person that put a cover letter in because you
Speaker 2 (36:54):
Feel like I put cover letter. I didn't put a cover letter into one of my applications, but they didn't have an option.
Speaker 1 (37:00):
That's what I'm saying is only if they have an option.
Speaker 2 (37:02):
Okay, good.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Yeah, I just think go a little bit above and beyond. No, no. I just think it takes an extra five, 10 minutes. But I just think it is important to do. And then you can also, by the way, I'm not staring in the corner of the races on the
Speaker 2 (37:19):
Tv. Another tip for rejection is don't say, but rejection is protection. And I know that sounds so corny and cheesy, but it's true. And rejection is protection because you have to trust that the best thing is going to find you. It's like you said, the universe, whatever it is you believe in, will meet you halfway as long as you're putting in. I genuinely believe you can me halfway that song, William.
Speaker 1 (37:46):
Halfway. Halfway. Yeah. I just think you have to, I'm a big believer in meeting halfway we've, because you have to put the work in and then you will be met with the right thing.
Speaker 2 (37:58):
I think a pivotal moment for me in my job search was that I actually was like, because I've been most of my life, very entrepreneurial and artist. Here we go again talking about it. But when I was a teenager, I was on a TV show called Backstage and I was doing really well financially from my age, two seasons of that show. And before that we all danced professionally and the next step, competitive dance, competitive. Competitive and professionally, the next step we got paid to be on that. And then after that I got paid for speaking or ambassador work or all this kind of stuff. So it was very fun, creative work. And now I'm at a place where I have to make money and the entrepreneurial route is super fun and exciting, but it also doesn't pay the bills presently.
Speaker 1 (38:49):
She's also having that she has to make money in a different way I
Speaker 2 (38:54):
Think than
Speaker 1 (38:55):
She had originally
Speaker 2 (38:56):
Imagined. That's something I had to come to terms with being a very entrepreneurial, creative person. If I could just be an artist, an entrepreneur and not have to do any other job, I would.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
Whereas that difference I feel like between she's and Maddie is Elle. And I always joke that we wish we could have a thousand lives. So actually I was talking about this in the car with Ellie yesterday on her way to the mall she got her nails done, which I don't have the money to do right now, but it's okay because nail polish also exists where you can just do it yourself. But Elle and I took her to the mall thing where we wanted to live. We've always been interested in sports. Sports. What I said, I was like lifestyle, fashion, entertainment industry is my big goal. Our big dream and our big passion in life is screenwriting and the entertainment industry, which is a crazy industry to be a passionate about. But wait, but I want able to finish this. It's true. Yeah. So we've always said that we wish we could live a thousand lives and we always thought that the screenwriting thing would happen a lot sooner than it has, but we just kind of reframed it and we're like, it's always going to be the end goal, but in the meantime, let's live some of our thousand lives that we've wanted to live.
(40:09)
Elle with Sports, I'm applying to things and so I'm manifesting that I work in either sports or fashion and beauty because then I can live one of my thousand lives. So we're just kind of looking at it as an opportunity, still being in the, I always and I just need
Speaker 2 (40:23):
Money.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
Maddie, I don't think I would live a thousand lives. I think there's just one she wants to live
Speaker 2 (40:29):
And I've been like that my whole life.
Speaker 1 (40:32):
It we'll, what I want and we'll live it. I'm enjoying it. This kind of phase of life, kind of like, oh, I always thought when I was younger I was like, oh, okay, I'm going to work in screenwriting. I want to be a screenwriter. It was the main goal and that's going to be it. And there's all these other things I would love to do, but so instead I'm taking this time in my early twenties because screenwriting is incredibly difficult to get into and it's not going to happen for a while. And we're working, we're still working towards it, but it's just something that it takes time and it's not something you can really control. I think it's like you try
Speaker 2 (41:06):
Just got to keep going with it. And I think most people have a side hustle. Most people have something that they have a passion project. They're working on the side. Even a lot of our or full-time or a full-time job even. We're going to this rooftop event. It's okay. It's okay. Just dad. It's okay. Our dog's right beside us here.
Speaker 1 (41:22):
He gets very upset when he hears loud noises.
Speaker 2 (41:25):
Okay. He's very,
Speaker 1 (41:26):
Oh,
Speaker 2 (41:27):
Hello. This is Maverick is our son. He's gone.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
Yeah, that to say, oh, sorry.
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Sorry. I lost my train of thought. We'll wrap this
Speaker 1 (41:36):
Up. But I was just going to say that if you relate to that at all, where you're like, I want to live a thousand lives, just see your twenties as a time to maybe live a couple, pin down a few of those lives that you want to.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
And a lot of our podcast guests, they worked, were working multiple jobs trying to build
Speaker 1 (41:56):
Their actually passion. Actually, that is something that kind of helped me with my mindset shift. Same is to our guests and them saying a lot of them have lived a thousand lives talking to Britt Baker.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
Oh my gosh,
Speaker 1 (42:10):
So many jobs before she's started Dow Janes. Yeah, before she started she was scooping ice cream. Oh, sorry, chapter
Speaker 2 (42:17):
Three. It's chapter three. She's right from ice cream scooper to self-made millionaire
Speaker 1 (42:25):
And she's done incredibly well for herself
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Entrepreneurial in her
Speaker 1 (42:28):
Thirties. We also talk about this with Benny who did overcompensating and now he's in his thirties and which Ava was on for five seconds
Speaker 2 (42:38):
On the show. She met him and he was lovely. He was lovely. We talk about that in another one. We talk about that in another one, but
Speaker 1 (42:42):
That hasn't come out yet. So sweet. But deserves that shout out. Yes. But what I was just going to say, for sure we do. We haven't met him, but what we know of him. Well, you met him on Sunday. Oh my God. True. Yeah. Anyway, is great. He was lovely. Yeah, he was great. But what I was saying is that he really kind of also opened her eyes to the fact that things can happen later and they maybe are meant to be happening later. He talked about this, about how
Speaker 2 (43:08):
He's 31 now
Speaker 1 (43:09):
And how him making it now versus if he was in his mid twenties when he first started it, the difference between what it would've been then versus now, he thinks it's really better now that it happened.
Speaker 2 (43:21):
I think it's basically meaning you grow into your opportunities. And
Speaker 1 (43:25):
We've even talked about that with screenwriting and it's meant that it's not meant to
Speaker 2 (43:32):
Happen yet,
Speaker 1 (43:33):
But
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Not going, don't work for, I think also actually the biggest lesson I've taken away from this time of life job search included is patience. Because for me, when something isn't happening, I think it should happen. I freak out, I panic. I have moments where I'm like, oh, well, I'm just not good at this. I should just throw in the towel and call it quits and nothing's going to happen. And the reality, you just need time and a lot of times to reach success, it just takes time. That's just the bottom
Speaker 1 (44:02):
Line. You just can't quit and then you'll outlast all the other ones that did quit.
Speaker 2 (44:08):
Well, exactly. I remember I had an acting teacher once who said actually the hardest time to be an actor is in your twenties because everyone, there's just so many who are trying to be actors in their twenties and then she's like, which with each decade everyone falls off. But that applies to any dream you're pursuing. So I think, yeah, like what we're saying, just time and patience. You're going to outlast everybody and it's like you're putting in the work. But I think I used to be work harder so that I could make it happen faster. But I think when you take your time and put in consistent effort, you learn the lessons you're supposed to learn in the right amount of time to you're supposed to fail and then learn from the failure and then adjust and adapt.
Speaker 1 (44:48):
Yeah, I think, yeah, to try and make sense of what I was getting at with as well is just the fact that his show happened later and dreams that he had happened later in his life. They were meant to happen at that time. And I think just keep going and things will happen at the time that they're supposed to, but keep working. Any final thoughts guys? I think we're starting to get a little,
Speaker 2 (45:12):
Okay, so the last thing I'm going to ask is what did you fail at this week? And I can answer that. Oh yeah.
