Chapter Thirteen: How Thamina Stoll Went From Broke to Financially Free in Her 20s

Ready for some real financial education? Join us for an unfiltered conversation as Thamina Stoll shares her journey from broke to financially free in her 20s. Through powerful storytelling and honest life lessons, Thamina reveals how financial independence is possible, even if you’re starting from zero. If you’re tired of feeling lost with money and want actionable personal finance advice, this episode is for you! We dive deep into budgeting, money management, and investing for beginners, all from the perspective of women who’ve been there.

Subscribe and join our community of financially empowered 20-somethings, committed to financial growth and supporting each other’s journeys.

Thamina’s story is proof that perseverance and determination can lead to financial freedom. Discover how she learned to save money, build wealth, and take control of her financial future.

By tuning in, you’ll gain practical tips for achieving financial independence, learn the importance of financial education, and get inspired to set—and crush—your own financial goals.

THAMINA'S FREE E-BOOK: https://www.thaminastoll.com/ebook

Key Takeaways:

Real strategies for financial education in your 20s

How to move from broke to financially independent

Budgeting tips that actually work Investing for beginners and building wealth

Connect with Thamina Stoll: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thaminastoll/

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Website: https://www.thaminastoll.com/

Germany's Top 100 Women of the Year: https://www.thaminastoll.com/about

Transcript:

My mom had me unexpectedly when she was really young. She was still in high school.

We were never like starving or anything. But, you know, my mom was still in high school and then went to college, right? So, like she wasn't earning any money for probably like the first, I don't know, 7 8 years of my life. And you're like 23, 24. Why should I start thinking about retirement? I used to be that person. decided to make a real hard pivot to tech and I joined LinkedIn and realized I didn't really know anything about money and I actually had a pretty bad relationship with money at the time and so now being at a point in my life in my career at age you know 30 where I do have the financial means to give back to my mom or like loved ones in general that way. It was one of those moments where like okay like this is like a true milestone for me.

We are here in New York City with Tamina Stole. Where's our Y? Thank you for coming. Thank you for having me. Thank you for having me. I've never been interviewed by three people at once. Especially not three people are related to one another.

A little daunting. We're all just staring at you. I'm so excited though. I love this. I walked in, you were so welcoming. It was just like great start. Good. I'm glad. I'm glad. And for our listeners, Tamina is an award-winning wealth strategist for women in tech. She's a real deal when it comes to finances in your 20s. So, we're super excited to have her on. Yay. Thank you so much. Again, my name is L. I'm Ava. And I'm Madison. And this is the 20some playbook. Tamina is also the founder of She Economist, which is helping women live life on their own terms in their career and finances. So, for our audience, can you kind of tell them a bit about what you do? Yeah, absolutely. I always like to say that I'm a multi-passionate like multi-hyphenate, right? I have so many different interests. So, like by day I work in big tech on the business side, B2B um sales specifically and by night and on weekends I do a lot of advocacy work, speaking uh advising in a women's economic advancement space. is very passionate about the intersection of personal finance, entrepreneurship, personal branding, venture capital, angel investing, and um really passionate about supporting women with radical careers career and financial self- advocacy. Really, that's what it boils down to at the end of the day. Yeah. Wow. That's all. Yeah, it's like a mouthful. That's me. How did you get into that? Like what was that journey like for you starting what you're doing? Yeah, totally. Great question. So, actually, funnily enough, when I entered college, I thought I was going to be a journalist. Uh, took a bunch of journalism classes, even like loved them, but then I was exposed to um the world of tech, social media, entrepreneurship through my innovation, entrepreneurship certificate at uh Duke and decided, wow, this is so interesting. Also, like journalism was kind of like starting to like die a little bit back then. I was like, okay, I I need a little bit more of a stable lucrative career. So decided to make a real hard pivot to tech and joined uh LinkedIn in 2018. Uh learned a lot about business and sales and software as a service, digital advertising and um along the way I realized, you know, I was I was 24 when I joined LinkedIn and realized I didn't really know anything about like money and I actually had a pretty bad relationship with money at the time. My first job out of college, I was living paycheck to paycheck. Did not contribute to to retirement. Did not save anything. Granted, I had a very like small salary. I think it was like $28,000 at the time, like annually. So like, you know, paid living paycheck to paycheck was justified. But when I got the offer from LinkedIn and moved from from Durham, North Carolina to Dublin, Ireland, I made a promise to myself that I would use this chapter, this new chapter in my life to build positive financial habits and started enrolling in all of the company benefits like you know company match for you know retirement employee stock purchase program really started to teach myself you know the ins and outs of investing in the stock market and um yeah that's how it all started. Wow. What would your advice be for someone who wants to do the same thing like maximize the wealth that they have in whatever you were doing at the time you were working for LinkedIn? Yeah. No, totally. I think and this is maybe something that is a little contrarian, but you know, we see a lot of people nowadays in their, you know, 20s who suggest, hey, like go all in on yourself, like join that startup, do your own thing. And while I don't necessarily disagree with the notion of not taking that leap and like betting on yourself, I do think there is a lot of inherent value in joining a corporation, you know, a big company. Yeah. To establish credibility, build a network of really valuable, you know, smart, accomplished people, but also take full advantage of corporate benefits that help you in terms of accelerating your your wealth building. you know, there's, like I said, company match, employee, um, stock purchase program. There's so many opportunities to really, you know, maximize your wealth building ability in your in your in your 20s. So, definitely take advantage. And I think something that a lot of people don't do early on is really educating themselves on what is available. And it's something that, you know, when you're like 23, 24, why should I start thinking about retirement now, right? Like like I I I get it. I I I used to be that person, right? But at the end of the day, when it comes to investing, wealth building, time is your best friend, you know, when it comes to compound interest and taking advantage of that what Albert Albert Einstein referred to as the eighth wonder of the world. Like, time in the market, as in having your money in the market for a long period of time, is so so critical when it comes to taking advantage. What What advice would you give to 20some who has money to invest but has no idea what they're doing when it comes to investing? Yeah, totally. Well, I do have a free ebook on my website.combook.

We can probably link to that in the show notes. We'll link in the show notes. Yeah. Um, and it's it's literally it's titled like what women need to know about investing. So, it gives you literally like it works a little bit on your mindset, but then also goes in nitty-gritty details of like investing, stock market, and whatnot. So, definitely do that. But something else that I think is really really helpful is kind of like reflecting a little bit on what what is your own relationship with money? sister maybe some, you know, childhood trauma like the way, you know, our family, our parents like dealt with like money issues and projecting them onto their children in some issues like that in in some instances that that definitely has an impact on our own personal relationship with money and like taking a step back and really reflecting that on that I think is really really important. But then also there's so many incredible people nowadays online that provide both free and paid resources, you know, like there is a, you know, Sim Carr from Girls that Invest, Tori Dunlip, her first 100K, Money with Katie. Um, the list goes on and on and on. So many incredible free resources. Start following the people in in in the space. Subscribe to their newsletters, listen to their podcasts, and just take it take it from there. and you'll see, you know, which person resonates with you the most. Amazing. Great advice. So, um, someone who's in a corporate job, I know there's tons of like I think most people are in corporate jobs. I feel like entrepreneurship is a bit less popular. Um, for someone in a corporate job, what would you say to them so they can maximize the benefits they're getting from their company? Yeah. No, totally. Um, so usually when you get a job offer, it would usually outline in the contract like what type of like especially financial benefits are available to you. Um, so definitely make sure you read the fine print um before you sign cuz you know when it comes to for example equity compensation, you know, there's so many different types of equity compensation depending on whether or not the company's already public or not, right? Is equity compensation what what is that? Yeah. I don't know what that means. No, totally. Okay. You know, I'm glad you're asking. We don't know a lot of no totally. So, let's start with public companies first. Um, so, you know, like an Apple or Microsoft for example, right? They are traded on the stock exchange, right? So, you can become a partial owner of the company by purchasing their shares, right? And that's what investing in the stock market means, right? Um, when you work for one of those companies, often times they grant you something that is called RSUs, restricted stock units, which basically means on top of your salary, they're also giving you shares for serving as an employee for the company for a certain like number of years. Um, usually it follows a what is called a vesting schedule. So you get let's say the first 25% of the total you know you know number of shares after year one the second 25% after year two and so on and so on. Um, so that's that's that's the most common form of equity compensation. But then if it's a company that is private, so for example, a scaleup or a startup or just a company that might already be big, but they decided not to go public. Um, there you have the opportunity to often times um have stock options. So you can buy a lot of shares like oftenimes thousands, tens of thousands, sometimes even like millions of individual shares for like a really really small like fraction of the price like let's say for like one share for 1 cent or something like that. And then you know if the company does well either gets acquired or goes public in the end then obviously your millions of shares can all of a sudden be worth millions and millions of dollars, right? Um and so that's why some people end up joining startups or scaleups or you know preipo companies because if they believe in the company if they believe that there's a high probability of the company going public or getting acquired then the financial reward is really really large. I'm sure you've heard of like Nvidia, which was all over the media over the last like year, year and a half, right? So, um I think there was a crazy stat around I think like every like one in 10 employees or something crazy like has a net worth of like $20 million now because they joined the company before the stock started taking off. Um which I believe was like in early 2024 towards the end of 2023. Wow. Um, so yeah, it is a little bit of of of a gamble, right? But and investing is well investing I wouldn't call it necessarily gambling if you're like very diversified, right? But like if you have all your eggs in one basket, right? Then that is certainly like a lot riskier as opposed to being exposed to a lot of different companies or industries. So cool. So your advice would be also to diversify industries as well. Yeah, definitely invest. If you think about it, if you're just exposed to one specific industry and for whatever reason, let's say like um hardware companies, right? We know there has historically been issues especially throughout CO with like um supply chain, right? Getting like individual like chips for example from Taiwan or like other parts of Asia getting over to Europe or to the US, right? As a result of that, you know, it's become more challenging for companies like Apple, for example, to to um build their iPhones or, you know, other pieces of hardware, right? Because the supply chain uh was was suffering and that can then certainly impact share prices and then impact, you know, an entire industry like more broadly, right? So that's why the recommendation is to be diversified because if one company or like one industry like goes down a little bit, there's like I don't know 10 20 other companies that can kind of like balance that out. This might be a specific question, but in how many different industries would you suggest people invest to start? Like five, three, like what's your general recommendation? Yeah. So I mean my general recommendation would be there is an opportunity to pretty easily diversify in a bunch of different companies and industries by investing in what is called ETFs, exchangeraded funds. So oftent times ETFs would have this broad exposure to let's say there is an ETF that tracks an index that is called let's say the SNP 500. The S&P 500 makes up um the 500 biggest companies in the United States. So obviously you have a lot of the tech tech companies, but you also have like consumer companies like Coca-Cola for example or you have like a like uh Walmart um you know like more like retail or you know uh something in probably like what Proctor and Gamble is probably also then there like in the CPG um space, right? So just purchasing one share of that ETF then all of a sudden gives you exposure to like these 500 different companies that probably represent at least like 10 plus different industries. Yeah. And would you recommend going with those bigger companies or trying smaller companies or do you recommend both? Again in favor of increased diversification definitely a mix right like there is also what we call like large cap midcap small cap. It's a differentiation between like companies that are really big like large cap, midcap, like medium size, they still make like probably like multiple nine figures in annual revenue, right? And like large um um small cap like probably like I don't know like eight multiple eight figures or something along those lines. But um just like in terms of different categorization which makes it a little bit easier to again be exposed to like different types of companies in terms of size, in terms of industry. Um yeah, very interesting. I'm I'm going to ask some like a bit of a pivot from this, but that was really interesting and I feel like I learned a lot from that. I'm glad. Yeah. No, I seriously I I don't know much about all this stuff. This is kind of like a foreign topic to me. So it's good. Yeah. Um what would be three words to describe your 20s? Oo, that is a very hard. Let's do it. Let's do it. Um, my 20s were exciting. They were

rewarding. Nice. And confusing. Okay. Good. Wow. Why confusing? Why confusing? because I felt like I entered my 20s as one person and came out as a completely different person. Yeah, definitely. I mean, I had the opportunity to live in three different countries throughout my 20s, right? Like that in and of itself. What countries did you live in? So, I was born and raised in Germany. So, lived there for the first 20 years of my life. Wow. And then spent some time there during co and like summers, right? M um then did go to college in the US, lived there for 4 years, then for my second full-time job for LinkedIn, moved to Dublin, Ireland. Wow. And then have been back in the States for now like almost three and a half years. So, wow. It's been a difficult transition for you to come here and live here, I would say. So, yes. I mean, I was super excited about the opportunity, you know, getting the chance to study at a top 10 US, many many people's dream, and it was like the best time of my life, like for sure. Um, but, you know, English is not my first language, right? I definitely had a lot of like self-limiting beliefs and wasn't sure like oh my goodness like am I like quote unquote like good enough like to to do well at a at a university that was so you know so worldrenowned. Um good for you for doing so it was definitely like pushed me out of my comfort zone. I would say like especially the first two semesters were were more challenging in that in that sense. But then over time obviously my language capabilities improved and I grew in self-confidence. I'd found my community. I'd kind of gotten adjusted to you know the cultural nuances. Um it's so much work learning a language like as people who have tried and failed languages like honestly kudos to you. Thank you. Seriously. And then to move somewhere without fully being comfortable in it either and then learning it and now you're so like you're so knowledgeable and it's all in English. That's like what a huge accomplishment. Thank you. I appreciate that. What was that like? Like how did you go from like the first couple of semesters like you know really adjusting? Was it the culture shock that was hard? Was it or was it like literally just everything like foreign country people like the whole deal? Yeah. No, great question. I mean, we already talked about language. Culture was not as much of a shock just because I had visited the US like a couple of times prior. I had participated in a student exchange program in high school. So, um I actually felt like I fit in really nicely in terms of like culture. But there's still like even in terms of communication style, you know, Germans are known for being like very like direct and straightforward and like efficient, right? And like Americans love their small talk and like you know going all out and so had to had to you know learn that a little bit in order to fit in. Yeah. Exactly. Okay. All right. Um let's wrap this up. Um, no. So that was a big piece and then just community right like you are moving to a different place at age I was 20 at the time trying to figure out who who I am like what finding my voice right all while also trying to make friends right so I did the thing that a lot of people do when they move to the US and join a college I joined a sorority which you know like Greek life very very interesting like I'm very glad that I did it. Like my best friends now are many of them are my my my sorority sisters. But that was also that was definitely a culture shock. I would say we don't have anything like that. No, we're Canadian and we don't really have like I think it's there are some there like they're there they exist but they're not big. One of our friends went to University of Florida. Oh. Oh. UF. Yeah. It's big. Yeah. and she, you know, they had some safety concerns with where she was staying. So, her parents were like, "Just go to sorority cuz you'll be safe." And I remember she facetimed us once like from the sorority. She goes, "Guys, I'm not a sorority girl. I'm just a girl in a sorority." She was just like, it was a culture shock for her, too. She was from Ecuador, so it was like she was like, "What is going on?" I can relate to that. Yeah. It definitely felt a little like culty. You know, you have all this like secret handshake and like songs and like songs. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's like like Yeah, it it's interesting. You found good friends. I found good friends. Yeah. Yeah. From a community building perspective, it it was great. And then you have college sports which also helps like build community on a college campus. That's something I still feel very strongly about. Go Duke. So, um so many

I I'm happy to hear because um dookies are are great. Yeah. I'm not biased at all. What role has friendship played in your 20s? Yeah, great question. Um, I would say I'm going to be super real here because I think it's important for people to to hear that. And look, everyone's experience is different, but I actually lost a majority of my high school friends when I moved over to the States, right? Like um I feel like that's very common. Yeah, it is very unfortunately. Yeah, it is unfortunately it is unfortunately common. Um, and you know sometimes that still makes me makes me sad, but it's just a reality. You know, you grow apart when you have so vastly like different experiences. You you stop being able to relate to one another. So whenever you meet up again, you only can reminisce about the past, but you don't really have anything to share anymore about the present or the future. Um, so that was tough. Yeah. I lost my my childhood best friend. We're best friends for like 17 years. And you know it's yeah it's it's it's it's it's sad and then I think you know you start to get to know yourself better what what are your interests and and whatnot and then you're more likely to align with those people right um and then another shift you know I I also lost some friends from college you know but I always like to say in order to make room for new people in your life you unfortunately have to let go of some others and not that you're like proactive ly doing that it sometimes kind of just like happens and you grow apart but the reality is you cannot manage like 300 friendships at the same time right like it's just the ones that you connect with the most I feel like will stick around yeah totally totally and I always recommend having like an inner circle or like a core group of friends but then you also need different different friends for different chapters of your life different purposes you know I'm very involved here in the you know women entrepreneurial environment here in New York. So, I have those friends. I still have my college friends. I'm good friends with women in my building who are like completely different like different backgrounds, different interests, you know. Um, and so diver diversify your friend groups like your portfolio. That's our key theme. Never speak diversification of everything. And then I wanted to ask you, I saw a LinkedIn post you did recently where you said you got to take your you're getting to take your mom on a her dream vacation and you're very proud of it because you've worked very hard to get there. Can you tell us a bit about that story because I really liked it. Yes. Well, thank you for asking. Yeah. So, quick backstory. Um, so my mom turned 50 this year and last fall I started to ask myself, okay, like like what should I do? This is like obviously like a big big milestone, right? like I want to honor it in like proper way. And so I came up with the idea of gifting her a surprise trip to Namibia, which had been like her dream destination for many, many, many years. And so I just pulled the trigger, like did that like behind her back um she happens to work for a travel agency. So then I reached out to one of her co-workers um and just like arranged everything. And then I flew to to Munich where I'm from like the day before her birthday. We celebrated, you know, the night before. And then after it turned midnight, I just like told her like, "Hey, a you and I were going on a trip and we're leaving in 4 days. Let's start packing." Oh my god. And yeah, I mean like the expression on her face totally like priceless. I will have that memory for the rest of my life. Like a mix of shock, overwhelm, excitement. It was just so cute. Um, and yeah, then we went on that trip and it was truly magical. Like I don't know, Namibia. You heard it here first. Maybe one of the most beautiful or the most beautiful country I've ever been to. Really? Where is it located? I've never heard of it. Yeah, it's uh in southern West Africa. So, it's like north of um South Africa and west of uh Botswana. Okay. Wow. It's straight out of Lion King. Like, we did the whole safari thing. We rented a car, did a round trip, drove from one lodge to the next and the country. So diverse in terms of like flora and fauna and it was just magical. Truly magical. So beautiful. Yeah. And I I remember you sharing a bit on LinkedIn on why it was so important to you that you got together that trip and can you share a bit about that as well? Yeah, totally. So, you know, my mom had me unexpectedly when she was really young. She was still in high school. Um, and so as you can imagine, I mean, we had amazing support from my grandparents. Like without them, like I I wouldn't be where I am today. Like truly incredible. So like we were never like starving or anything, but you know, my mom was still in high school and then went to college, right? So like she wasn't earning any money for probably like the first, I don't know, seven, eight years of my life. Um so everything that she that she had, you know, child support and like the support she got from my grandparents like went straight back into me and my little brother. And so um money in that sense was like a little bit tight growing up um for my mom specifically. And so now being at a point in my life, in my career at age, you know, 30 where I do have the financial means to give back to my mom or like loved ones in general that way um is truly special and was one of those like aha moments where like wow like and I made it moment. Yeah. Sort of like I made it. Yeah. It was one of those moments where like, okay, like this is like a true milestone for me because this trip like wasn't, you know, not not horrendously expensive, but it was it was money, right? And it's not necessarily something that my mom could have easily afforded. So, um, how beautiful is that? Yeah, I love that. Love it. Absolutely. Beautiful. And another little pivot, I just wanted to go back to university quickly. Yes. Um, did you what did you study in university and did that apply to the jobs you did after? Yeah, great question. So, I'm going to prepare. It's a mouthful. So, um I majored in political science and then at Duke we have this thing called certificate programs and a certificate is less than a major but more than a minor. So, I did two certificates, one in policy, journalism and media studies and the other one in innovation and entrepreneurship. Wow. Yeah. And so, again, entered college thinking I was going to end up in journalism, hence the journalism certificate and the political science major. um but left ending up in business and big tech, right? So, it's also something I want people to know. Just because you commit to a certain, you know, major or field of study in university doesn't mean you're like married to that field or, you know, profession for the rest of your life. I would argue that most people I know who are like my age, you know, late 20s, early mid-30s, they studied something that has absolutely nothing to do with what they do today. And I think there's a lot of pressure on on young people nowadays when they enter college that they need to have this like 5 10 20 year long plan and like if they commit to a certain major like you're locked in for life basically, right? And I want to take that pressure away because you're allowed to evolve. You're allowed to to discover yourself to find your voice and find what you're truly passionate about in life. Would you say LinkedIn played a big role in like using LinkedIn played a big role in getting the job in LinkedIn? Like a lot of people talk about optimizing their LinkedIn profile nowadays. Like how did you go from you know working a job you your other job before LinkedIn to LinkedIn? Yeah. Yeah. No, it's a little bit meta here like no but it's a good question like so for me I was very passionate about joining LinkedIn as employee because I had firsthand experience with how powerful the platform had been. I had landed two part-time jobs and some mentors um because of LinkedIn. And so um when I applied to join tech companies, which you know was kind of like trying and put not putting my eggs in in in one basket. So I applied like everywhere, you know, but I remember it was pretty straightforward. It was like an easy apply for the job at LinkedIn and they were looking for someone who was like fluent in German. Oh, that that's me. And like I had a complete profile, that's for sure. But like often times when you like hit all of the qualifications and like a recruiter would reach out to you if if they feel like okay this could be a potential good fit and then they jump on an initial like recruiter screening call with you. So that that's pretty much what happened like without really like knowing much about the specific role or the team. It just sound like okay I I checked the boxes. I applied and about 3 weeks later recruiter reached out to me and yeah the rest is history. Yeah. So cool. I love that. Thanks. Yeah. And I also Sorry, I wanted to go quickly back to that transition for you coming out of university and getting into tech. Like what did that look like for you? Yeah. Especially with your major being something different. Yeah. Like what did that did was there things you had to do to get experience to work at the tech company or did they teach you how to do it? Like what did that look like? And how did it make you feel too because I can imagine you know these days people in the job market are just so lost and confused. Yeah. No, totally. And I want to preface it by saying like I am grateful that I graduated in 2017 and not in 2025. Like I I have a sister-in-law who is about to graduate from from Berkeley. She's super smart data science major, econ minor and she's really struggling because you know the economy is in different or the job market at least is in a different place um than it was like back when when I was recruiting for jobs. So, she has a lot of competition with people who've who were laid off over the last couple of years. You know, people who have like 2, three, four, five years of full-time work experience. Um, so just want to acknowledge that, especially for those people who are listening who also are struggling with that. Like you're not alone. For me specifically, um, I think what was really helpful is the fact one, I joined what is called a rotational program. So rotational programs are programs that are oftent times offered by bigger tech companies and they kind of allow you to rotate through different departments of the company and get like pretty holistic exposure to different types of um roles and and teams and some leadership exposure as well. So because of that it was kind of like I was trained on the job. So they were really looking for people with like potential and people who had previously demonstrated like leadership experience and like being, you know, gogetters. So it was really mainly my summer internships that I had done in college, any part-time jobs and any extracurricular activities, you know, like clubs I was I was a part of. Um, and you know, demonstrating throughout the interview process that like, okay, like I I I have potential. Yeah, that sounds awesome. That's incredible. Yeah. Is that something that you got through school like afterward that the I can't Yeah. Where do you find that? What was it called? Sorry. The rotational program. Yeah. Rotational program. Like how did you find that? That that the specific one that I ended up joining I found on LinkedIn. But like so people can look there on LinkedIn. Yeah. You would you would find that on like Okay. Companies career pages as well. So you can Yeah. I've never heard of that. Yeah. No, I I haven't either. learn something new. I'm learning a lot on this podcast. Seriously, we are learning a lot. So, um, we're going to do like a little small pivot here, too. But, um, in your 20s, did you have a rock bottom moment? And if how did you navigate it if you did? Yeah. No, definitely a few, but um I think the one I wanted to talk about today is um depression. So it was interesting because at the time after I'd moved to to Dublin for for my job at LinkedIn, like the first couple of months were super super exciting, like new country, new company, new people, new everything, right? But then after a couple of months, probably like six to nine months in, I started feeling like a little bit anxious and lost. I started having like almost like weekly panic attacks. Um, at the time my my boyfriend and I were also doing long distance between the US and Ireland. So like there's just like a lot to navigate at the same time. Um, but what struck me, you know, looking back was really like on paper my life looked perfect. I just graduated from top university, landed a job at a very prestigious company, was like making like for my age like decent decent enough money, right? Being surrounded by really smart, kind talented, fun people. Um, but there was a big disconnect between how I was perceived from the outside and how I felt on the inside, right? Um, and that actually triggered a lot of guilt for me because again, like I was such a privileged position, right? Um, who am I to complain? You know, there are millions and millions of people would want to be in my shoes, right? So, for a long time, I was suffering in silence. Um, nobody but my boyfriend really knew what was going on because I would go to work, I was a top performer and like, you know, you just couldn't tell, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But then over time, I started opening up gradually, um, talking with some of my girlfriends and then eventually launched my first podcast, FemHive, where I started opening up about my mental health struggles. And then it really resonated with a lot of women. And it turns out a lot of them were going through something similar, you know, like there's for me it was definitely a depression. And I I I I was seeing a therapist at the time. Other people refer to it as like postgraduation blues, postgraduation depression, because I think at the end of the day, what's really challenging for young people is, you know, up until you graduate from university, you have a pretty pre-established life. Like, you know, like after first grade comes second grade, after middle school comes high school, it's all planned out for you, right? Um, but once you graduate, all of a sudden you have to you're on your own. You have to make up those milestones on your own. And there's nobody who really taught us how to do that. So I felt like, you know, my college was like, oh, like here's your degree and an adult salary. Good luck out there, right? Yeah. Um, and so I was really struggling with that, you know, identity, friends being being far away from friends, from my partner, and also realizing that the corporate world was definitely not quite as glamorous as it was made out to be. Oh my gosh. Um, so yeah, I think that was that was definitely something I was struggling with a lot at age like 24, 25, 26. I appreciate you sharing that because I've also struggled with depression and hearing that you know you've been able to accomplish and achieve so much in your personal life and professional life is very reassuring to hear and in my you know hard moments I would always remind myself of people like you that I know who have been through the hard things I've been through. So I really appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you also for sharing. Appreciate that. Yeah. I think um another thing I want to ask is again I feel like we're jumping over with the questions but I want to ask you um has your definition of success changed like when you were you know starting at 20 you know what was that definition and and what is it now? Yeah. Yeah. No, I love that question. I think that's also so important to address. If you'd asked me in like my early 20s or like even when I started my my corporate job, if you'd asked me what I envisioned my career and life to look like, I would have told you probably, yeah, like sea sweetite executive at a Fortune 500 company. Yeah. Typical like type A high achieving like woman, right? Now at age 30, I can tell you that's the last thing I want to do my life. Um, I think over time I've really been able to deeply reflect on what my core values in life are and identified that freedom is my number one value. And so when you are a leader in in you know a very visible leader in in in a public company or even a a scaleup or a startup then like you're not truly free. You're always like even if you're you know the CEO of a big you know Fortune 500 company you're your your your job is to create shareholder value at the end of the day, right? Um, and also seeing what some of those leaders lives look like kind of behind the scenes and especially like women who, you know, climbed the corporate ladder and all of a sudden, you know, in their 50s they're like super burnt out and like they never had time to see their kids, you know, grow up. Um, that's just not the kind of life I want to live. I want to live life with a little bit more intention. And don't get me wrong, I still have very lofty like career goals. But my my goal in life is really to maximize freedom and to maximize optionality as in I love that create options for myself and really maximize being able to do what I want when I want with whom I want and do very little I hate. Yeah. And have you experienced burnout? And and if you have, how do you navigate that or how do you get through it? Yeah. Like what advice would you have for anyone experiencing that? I would say I either experienced burnout or was very very close to that in the fall of 2023. Um at the time I was you know navigating a demanding 9 toive job. I was navigating some, you know, like immigration challenges or like preparing for like my green card petition while also doing a lot of stuff on the side, public speaking, like writing like content, like all the things. And I'd gotten to a point eventually, I remember it was like around Thanksgiving of 2023 where I was just like, damn, I'm physically, mentally exhausted. I didn't really have anything to give to anyone, anything. And I was literally just like dreading getting up in the morning and doing all over again and just like, "Oh my goodness, like I just need I just need to breathe and like take a break." And um yeah, that was a little bit of a wakeup call for me because then, you know, I had some time off over the winter holidays luckily and then um decided that the first couple of months of 2024 I would just take a step back like say no to most public speaking requests and just focus on healing on on self-care and and and that helped a lot. Um yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I want to ask a bit about cuz I I've read a bit about your fertility journey and did you ever feel in your 20s the pressure of like my my biological clock is ticking with each year I get closer to 30? Like I know you didn't know prior to um but I know for me I read a book about you know the how your fertility goes down at 35 and I'm still single and I'm 26 and I have moments where I feel anxious about that. like what was that like for you? Yeah, first of all, your feelings are super valid. Um I mean I'm about to turn 31, so like for me it's like oh holy moly, like it's getting getting really real. Um I would say I didn't feel it quite as much in my earlier mid20s yet. I started feeling a little bit more anxious in my late 20s like 27 28. Um, but that's because you're also like fed this like societal narrative around, you know, you're really only like worthy as a woman if you have children, right? Or like you have to give up your career, make significant career sacrifices um when you have children, even if you assuming you are in a heterosexual relationship, right? And even if you have a very responsible, mature, emotionally intelligent, and just like great male partner, at the end of the day, like they'll never, no matter how many diapers they change or how many times they pick up the kids from school, they'll never be able to compensate for the physical, emotional, like hormonal, you know, sacrifices like women ministrators have to make when they have biological children. And so it it's something that I've always been a little anxious about just because I knew that at some point I was going to have to face those realities. Um and yeah, now at age 31 it's like oh man like I feel like I'm not ready yet. But then also everyone tells me like you'll never feel truly ready. So yeah, it's that's true. Yeah. I think it's a little unfair that we as women like have that added pressure and like even thinking about how that impacts the way we date and like we you know engage in in romantic relationships. Um yeah, you're definitely not alone. I will say you thinking about that and like even just educating yourself on like fertility, I think you're probably ahead of the curve. Um, you know, I wish that at age 25, 26, I had known what I now know about fertility, infertility, like um, egg freezing, IVF, all all of that. Um, because, yeah, as as as you know by now based on on my own journey, your fertility can decline much earlier than age 35. And so, um, again, going back to what we said about investing earlier, time is definitely im important. Um, but at the end of the day, what I'm just so passionate about is helping women make more educated decisions about their lives, including their money, their careers, their bodies, right? um you know decisions based on science, based on self advocacy. By no means do do I say that like every woman is supposed to have children or want to have children, right? But what I am fiercely passionate about is women putting themselves in a position where they can maximize all of their options, right? Like even if you're not sure if you want to have children ever, like again, it's your prerogative. You don't have to have children, right? But I if you're even even considering it like even just like a slither like like 1% means a lot and you have the opportunity to freeze your eggs for because it is a corporate benefit for example then please take advantage because you don't want to put yourself in a position where later on you have to ask yourself oh what if or where you're going to have regrets. Yeah. You don't want to eliminate that option. Yeah. And I've heard a lot about women who, you know, didn't maximize their benefits and options and later in life, you know, it becomes a real devastating um thing for them to go through. So, I appreciate you sharing that. Yeah. Yeah. No, totally. It's a good thing to be aware of. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. It's such a like being single at 26 for me is like such an anxious feeling, which is like I think also partly like I know your mom was a young mom. My parents were young when they got married. Like they were like 25, which is like pretty young for and so when I was 25, I had a moment where I was like, "Uh oh." Like, not that I want to be married, you know, but it's like like you talk about with societal pressures and expectations. It's it's a lot to navigate in our 20s. Yeah. No, totally. I I get that. And again, your feelings are super valid. You're not alone with that. And like I I think you would probably agree with this. Like for me sometimes I almost like envy my mom because even though it was like hard to navigate but like it was almost like the decision was made for her in that way, right? And now she's like 50 and she's she's single and just like enjoying like single life and kind of like reliving her her 20s and 30s and um Yeah. So I can I can definitely relate. That's that's funny. Yeah, that's Oh my god. She kind of reversed it. Yeah. Yeah. No, totally, totally. She is there a belief you had in your 20s that actually turned out to be completely wrong. I think there often times is that expectation that your life and your career is just like a linear path when in reality it's just not like it's like like this, right? You have your ups and downs and then you know your circles and then it's just Yeah. Um, but I think that is honestly like part of the human experience. Um, it is just not linear. And I think we all just have to give ourselves a little bit more grace. Yeah, I agree. Again, like type a high achieving like smart women, you know, all of us here at the table, like it's it's hard and easier said than done. And there are those days where you're just like, "Oh my goodness, like I I what am I even doing?" Um, Um but I think over time what does help is you get to collect more and more data points over time and looking back you're able to refer those data points as in like learnings experiences failures you know moments of growth right where you're able to realize well first of all even though XYZ didn't necessarily like work out the way I'd initially hoped or expected There was that silver lining, right? Yeah. That kind of like everything happens for a reason and also like, hey, I was in equally or even more challenging situations before and I was always able to figure it out somehow. So, growing that level of self-confidence like I may not have all the answers right now. There's a lot of uncertainty. There's a lot of challenges. It's an uphill battle. But I can tell you already like there's 10 10 10 experiences in the path where I was able to figure it out on my own and I'm only like growing stronger with age. So I think that is also something important to keep in mind. I absolutely amazing. And was there a book or podcast or article that really changed the way you saw your 20s? H I don't know if it was just like one specific resource that I could if there's point to but um I I really loved Glenn and Doyle's Untamed. I know it's kind of like you know it's a popular one. It's a popular one, I I guess, but I I read that when I was uh on vacation Costa Rica a couple of years ago and and that was just so beautiful and so relatable and um I don't know if like spiritual awakening is the right word for it, but um it definitely opened my eyes when it comes to a lot of you know like the self- advocacy um narratives. Um other than that, big fan of J. Cheddy and like his podcast. Um what else? Like Diary of CEO is also something I've been really enjoying lately. And um yeah, I just really enjoy following a lot of like thought leaders in this space. like people show up with a lot of like authenticity and vulnerability which are also like two of my core values because I think you know if us showing up authentically and vulnerably helps just one person feel less alone and it's already worth it you know that's how I see when I share about fertility or mental health or immigration challenges or like identity crisis right like I often get the question like Tamina how are you able to share all of that like on LinkedIn or like so like publicly and like always give them the same answer like if it helps just one person exactly feel seen feel heard then it's already worth it and based on like these kind messages I receive from women all over the world every single week I I know what I share matters and and that's kind of what keeps me going. Yeah, for sure. I can totally feel that bravery as well to share that stuff. So seriously like you should be proud of yourself. Thank you. Appreciate that. We're fans over here, so I see her on LinkedIn all the time and I'm like, "Yay!" Thank you. I appreciate that. Um, the last question I have for you is, what's one financial lesson, big or small, you wish you'd learned sooner in your 20s? I learned sooner.

I think for me, I knew on paper what compound interest was because like I probably learned about it at some point in school, but it was very theoretical and not really applicable to, you know, my real life. And once I started fully grasping the power of compound interest, probably at like age 24, 25, I had this like big like aha moment when I started playing around with compound interest calculators and like just like playing around with the numbers and plugging in, okay, if I invest $100 more per month and for five more years or 10 more years, like how how would the total number I would have like 30 40 years later like change? And and once I understood and got a feeling for the numbers, I was like, "Wow, why did I not start investing in kindergarten?" Like again, like so much time to give ourselves some grace. But um you know, one of the first things I did when my little cousin turned 18, I was like, "Um, we're going to set up a a brokerage like investment brokerage account for you. we're going to give you 300 bucks and we're going to invest that now and you're going to contribute $25 like every or 25 in her case like every single month. So she by the time she is 2425 which is when I started investing she already has like a massive head start. So wow that's amazing. And just quickly how do you explain compound interest for someone who has no idea what that is? Okay compound interest think of it as a snowball. Okay. Right. So you start with a small little ball that you form. You get some snow from the ground fall. You put it in your hands and you you form a snowball. It's like maybe the size of I don't know like an orange for example. And then you let it roll down a hill or a mountain and then obviously it picks up more snow or time, right? And by the time it it you know arrives at the bottom, all of a sudden it's just like this huge huge thing, right? So that's that's basically what compound interest is. You invest let's say $100 and then over the course of a year let's say you get 10% interest like sing simple math right then at the end of year one you have $110 and then you keep investing but now you don't start out with $100 you start out with $110 then you get another 10% and so you gain interest on interest so not just interest on the principal sum the original $100, but interest on top of $100, then $10 after one, and so on and so on. And that just leads to this like over time exponential growth. And it's it's it's really crazy. Like I highly recommend everyone who's listening type in compound interest calculator in Google and and just play around with a couple of different scenarios just and they don't have to be realist realistic either like don't just put in something that is like feasible for you right now. I actually recommend that you play around with like crazy numbers just so you get a feeling for for for for what compound interest actually is and so powerful. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. All right. I think we can end there. Yeah. No, this was awesome. Thank you so much. Oh my gosh. Thank you so much for this conversation. I learned so much. I learned an incredible amount today. I was so excited to have you on cuz I wanted to ask you these specific questions. I'm so glad. Thank you so much for creating this much needed um podcast and for for holding um the space for me. I had had a blast. So, thank you so much. Thank you so much. And we're going to link we're going to link in the description where you can find her. She's amazing. You should follow her on every platform that she has cuz I love seeing her stuff. Seriously, so much. I appreciate you so much. Thank you for watching and thank you. [Music] We stayed in the beautiful Westgate, New York Grand Central for the duration of our stay and it was really fun. The Westgate treated us to a cozy room and a beautiful boardroom to film in and the location was just spectacular. If you're headed to New York and want a place that brings both comfort and charm, hit the link in our show notes and treat yourself to a stay at Westgate New York Grand Central. [Music]